Host: Troy Madsen, Scot Singpiel
Guest: Mitch Sears
Producer: Scot Singpiel, Mitch Sears
In This Episode
One Millennial's Turning Point
Mitch is a producer and the editor for the Who Cares About Men's Health podcast. His health turning point began with working on this very podcast. Every week he listens to professionals talk about how important it is for men to take their health seriously when they're younger. He hears about the "terrible things" that can happen if he doesn't start taking care of himself.
Mitch just recently turned 30 years old and finally has decent health insurance for the first time in almost 10 years. He may be a little scared for one reason or another, but this podcast has been the catalyst to get him to start doing the things he needs to do, so that he can get his health back on track.
Looking Good Doesn't Mean You're Healthy
Mitch is tall, relatively thin, and looks like he works out. He may "look" healthy, but Mitch doesn't consider himself a healthy guy. Despite his appearance, Mitch has a history of bad habits, nagging health issues, and health problems.
For most of his life, Mitch has been heavy. He is thinner at age 30 than he has been for most of his life. Bad diet and low activity led him to top out around 240 pounds three years ago. He's lost a significant amount of that weight over the past three years.
Mitch has also had a long history of smoking that has impacted his cardiovascular health.
Mitch's activity level began to drop in high school after he sustained a serious knee injury while running cross-country. The injury has become a chronic problem that he has been unable to treat before. The injury keeps him from doing any intense hiking or jogging with friends like he used to. He knows he needs physical therapy, but hasn't had the ability to seek out treatment for years.
It's important to remember that every guy is going through their own health journey. Just because someone "looks" a certain way, does not necessarily mean they are the epitome of health.
The Problem of Insurance
One of the reasons that men - especially young men in the U.S. - don't seek out medical treatment is that they are uninsured or under-insured. Mitch has been in that position for most of his 20's.
"I would rather go uninsured than starve or not have a place to live," says Mitch. "I ask, is it worth that $100, $200 to potentially get a bill that I cannot pay. Especially when [my health condition] not killing me right now."
Dr. Troy Madsen sees this situation often with younger people that come into the emergency room. These young men are paying hundreds of dollars a month for only catastrophic insurance, which doesn't allow them to seek out the preventative care they probably should be getting.
Even the Biggest Health Problems Can Be Easy to Ignore
Mitch says he's having trouble in just about every aspect of his health. Besides the things he's already mentioned, he is a chronic insomniac, averaging around five hours of sleep a night.
His diet fluctuates significantly, going from good to bad. While he and his partner were preparing to be on camera for a documentary in Europe, their diet became intense. They were watching their macros and weighing out exact portions of food that wasn't that appetizing. He may have lost a bit of weight for the film, but Mitch hated it. He hated losing a Sunday to preparing meals that he didn't love eating.
He is learning that when it comes to achieving health goals you need to find what works best for you and make small, reasonable changes in your habits, if there's any chance in the changes sticking.
Mitch has also been trying to quit smoking. After trying to quit cigarettes for years, he switched to vaping a few years ago and is now working to quit the vape. He's tried all sorts of ways to quit, but none have stuck. He'll be reaching out to professionals to help find a method that will work best for him.
Even though he has known for quite some time that he needed to make some changes in his lifestyle, he admits that it can be easy to just ignore your health at his age.
"It's so easy when you are not hurting every single day," admits Mitch, "I know I'm not feeling the best I possibly could, becauseI don't work out as much as I should. But, it's not like, my heart is killing me every day and I need to turn my life around. It's really easy to say ‘eh, I'll do it later.'"
Now that he has insurance and the motivation of the podcast, it's time to get serious about his health.
Taking Charge of Your Health Can Be Scary
Mitch is a little overwhelmed with all the new changes he's making with his health. He's been surprised by the amount of anxiety he's experiencing with facing the realities of his health.
For example, a simple thing like a glucose level test is stressing him out. He knows he has a genetic predisposition for diabetes. He has some family members that have type 2 diabetes. He has even exhibited some minor symptoms that may be signs of diabetes. He knows he should go get tested and take the steps necessary to treat the condition he may have.
But he finds himself thinking that getting the test done would "make [the condition] real."
"In my brain, I'm healthy now," says Mitch, "As soon as that piece of information comes, I won't be." There's a part of him that would rather not know.
Troy argues that it's better to go through that stress and start caring now - at Mitch's age - than later in life. Troy says that most people don't start caring until they're in their 50's, when their health problems begin to be serious. For example, most men don't start caring about their heart health until the have a heart attack.
Troy assures Mitch that by taking care of things when he's younger, he's doing better than a majority of people.
It's Important to Recognize Your Health Starting Point
Mitch recently began working with a personal trainer to not only learn how to work on his physical fitness, but to take a full fitness assessment to find out his starting point. It did not go as well as he was hoping.
Mitch believed his cardiovascular health was better than it actually was. Most of his strength and flexibility tests were deemed "fair" or "needs improvement." And after just 20 minutes of slightly rigorous activity, he found himself sweating and completely out of breath. His trainer chose to postpone and adapt his cardio assessment because he was struggling.
It's easy to assume you're healthier than you are if you only base your health by what you look like in the mirror. Mitch may have been embarrassed at his poor fitness test results, but that's the reality of where his fitness currently is.
The body can take a while to adapt to a new reality. It can take months to years to lose your physical fitness. Likewise, it can take a while to get it back. It's important to realize that you're not going to reach your peak fitness in just six weeks.
Troy reminds Mitch that it's important to start small with your health goals and work up to where you'd like to be. A good start is 30 minutes of activity three times a week. Just that small amount of activity can lead to significant health benefits.
Your Nagging Health Issues Can Be a Source of Mental Stress
For Mitch, the most important thing he wants to work on with his health is his nagging health issues. He's hoping that by finally treating some of the problems he's dealt with for years, he can work through some of the nagging anxiety that chronic health issues can bring.
Mitch sometimes finds himself fearing that those seemingly small issues could actually be something worse. When he gets a pain in his chest from heartburn, there's a part of his mind that thinks back to his years as a chain smoker. It can be hard not to assume the worst when a person has a less than stellar health history and hasn't been treated in years.
Stay Focused on Where You Came From
Troy insists that one of the most important ways to stay motivated is to focus and celebrate the progress that has been made, rather than dwell on how far you have to go.Despite Mitch's less than stellar medical history, the embarrassment with the personal trainer, and the fear and anxiety of the unknown, he's still come a long way in his health journey.
Troy reminds Mitch that he's lost 40 pounds and has cut down significantly on his smoking. He's taking steps to seek professional medical help. These are all significant, positive steps in the right direction towards a healthier life.
Scot also reminds us that there is no ideal "perfect health". It's instead a type of "practice" that a person does every day. It's the practice of learning what works and doesn't work for you as a person. It's the practice of consistently reevaluating your lifestyle and working to improve it. It's the practice of staying positive and motivated to work towards your goals, while celebrating the steps you've already made.
Health is about progress and practice, not a final destination.
Just Going to Leave This Here...
On this episode's Just Going to Leave This Here, Scot has noticed a strange phenomenon at the grocery store: men will never take the large shopping cart, regardless of how many items they are actually buying. And Troy has been listening to Factfulness by Hans Rosling, and is learning that the world may actually be a much better place than we believe it is.
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Scot: Oh, here's the problem. Pro tip guys, pro tip.
Troy: Pro tip.
Scot: I have my headphones on, did not have them plugged in. So here's your radio podcasting pro tip, Troy. You expect to hear something in headphones, plug them in.
Troy: It's a good tip.
Scot: It's a podcast that has tried to create a movement. The movement is to get men to care about their health. And if you already care about your health, you're in the right place. You'll be able to get some good information and inspiration right now. My name is Scot Singpiel. I am the Senior Producer of TheScopeRadio.com, and I care about men's health.
Troy: And I'm Dr. Troy Madsen. I'm an emergency physician at the University of Utah, and I care about men's health.
Mitch: And I'm Mitch Sears. I edit and produce this podcast, and I care about men's health.
Scot: We brought Mitch in because we want to talk to men much like us that do care about their health. And one of the things we'd like to find out is the turning point. And Mitch's turning point is interesting. And then, he's got some interesting stories to share as to how he's trying to turn things around a little bit. So, first of all, Mitch, your turning point, what was it?
Mitch: Editing this podcast. It's, like, no joke. Every week I sit down and I edit and I'm in the studio recording with you guys and I hear about all the terrible things that could happen. Because I just turned 30. I just turned 30 a few months ago and I keep hearing about how I need to start taking it seriously right now. And it's got me anxious. It's got me, like, kind of excited in a way to try to take back my health. I finally have insurance for the first time in 10 years, so it's time to start doing this stuff. And it scares me. It scares me that, like, you know, all these terrible things could be down the line, and I haven't even seen a doctor for anything but, like, an injury in the last forever.
Troy: And what's your, kind of, your health history prior to this? Have you been involved in sports? Are there different activities you've done, you know, things like that, that you felt like, "Hey, I'm active," or . . . How would you describe things, you know, before just doing this podcast?
Mitch: Oh, no. No. And that's one of the things editing this podcast . . . I am so unhealthy, guys. Like, for most of my life I have been overweight. This is actually the thinnest I've ever been at this moment in time. You know, I topped out at 240 and almost all fat just maybe three years ago. History of smoking. I have some cross-country joint injuries from back in high school that have never fully been treated . . .
Troy: So you're a runner though. You ran cross country in high school.
Mitch: I did to try to prepare for sprints and then ended up with a pretty serious injury on my left knee that I was in a brace and taking anti-inflammatories for almost nine months.
Troy: And would you say that's where you really started to back off on exercise? Was it after that injury?
Mitch: Oh, absolutely. Because even going on a long hike and things like that, like, you know, I would decide to . . . I even got into college and I'm like, "Oh, yeah, there's some friends that I can go jogging with or whatever." And then we'd be a couple of miles out, and then my knee would flare up and I'd be hobbling back and trying to Uber back to the dorms, you know. So I've kind of stepped back since that injury.
Troy: To look at you though, you look like a healthy guy, you know. You look at you, you're like, "This guy is in good shape." Clearly, you do not look overweight at all. You look like you work out. And so it's, you know, to hear that you really felt like you were not in the best of shape, but obviously, you made a lot of changes just in the last few years, it's surprising to hear that.
Mitch: Well, and that's kind of when I was talking to Scot the other day about all of this is it's, you know, for sure, you look at me and it's like, "Hey, you look . . ." you know, I'm a tall, relatively thin, you know, guy, who just looks fine. But at the same time, I have a bad history. I have chronic injuries, and I haven't checked on them. I mean, one of the things that you guys talk about all the time is those nagging health issues, and I have plenty that I haven't had a chance to look at.
Scot: Just because of lack of insurance?
Mitch: Lack of insurance, primarily. I mean, you know, that's one of the things that I think, you know, that needs to be talked about more is that when we talk about why don't men care about their health and especially why do young men not care about their health, you know, I have been in a situation where I can't afford the rates every single month. I would rather go uninsured than starve or not have a place to live. Right? And so, for me, it's just, you know, is it worth that $100, $200, the potential of maybe getting a big, huge bill at the end of it that I cannot pay to go get these little nagging issues taken care of if they're not killing me right now?
Scot: Yeah.
Troy: Yeah. And your story, it's not at all uncommon. I see people in the ER all the time in their twenties and thirties who don't have health insurance. Again, it's that cost. Like, "Why am I paying this much for . . . " really, for catastrophic insurance. That's really what you're insuring as well. If something really bad happens. So you kind of roll the dice, and then maybe something happens and then I see them in the ER. But I don't think that's at all uncommon.
And I think your story too about being very active, it sounds like you were running, you were doing sprints, doing all that stuff and track and cross country in high school, you got an injury and things just stopped. And I think a lot of people are very active in high school, in high school sports. They get to college, they don't have that same opportunity to participate in team sports, and then the fitness just kind of tapers off from there.
Scot: Yeah, and then you have to become more responsible for it on your own. It becomes less social, less school and more personal driven, which it's a challenging thing.
Troy: It's very challenging.
Scot: It's a challenging thing. So you have started to take some steps to kind of change things. Where do you find your biggest struggles? Is it nutrition, exercise, sleep, managing the stress, nagging issues, smoking, drinking? Where are you at?
Mitch: Oh, all, I think, of it.
Scot: Check.
Mitch: I mean, man, it's just when I got . . . I'm helping you guys, come up with some of these ideas, we're brainstorming and things and we keep going over the core four plus one more and we're talking about nagging health issues and everything and you guys are just hitting on all of my weak spots. I mean, I'm a chronic insomniac. I average about five hours of sleep a night. That's just where I'm at. My food goes from good to bad. I mean, me and my boyfriend, we just shot a documentary in France this past summer and we, like, hit it hard, you know. We were working out every single day and doing all the meal plan and the macro watching and everything like that. And I don't want to do it. You know, it was not sustainable.
Scot: Yeah, you were eating some kind of crazy stuff that you just didn't even like eating, which I mean, you can't . . .
Troy: Yeah, you can't make it like that.
Mitch: I didn't like eating it. I didn't like spending my Sundays cooking it all for the week and weighing it out and putting it in little boxes. I'm not that guy. And I hear you guys talk and some of the guests, and I'm like, "Oh, my God, that's not who I am." You know? And then I, you know, I've been struggling with quitting smoking for years, you know, I . . .
Scot: You used to smoke?
Mitch: . . . switched to the vape and been now been working on getting rid of that for the last three years. So, you know, I'm working on that cessation. I'm looking to hopefully get some, like, professional help, trying to get to there and it's, you know, that's just it. It's so easy when you're not, like, hurting every single day, you know?
I know I'm not feeling the best I possibly could, because I don't work out as much as I should and things like that, but, you know, it's not like, "Oh, man, my heart's killing me every day. I need to turn my life around," you know, or, "Oh, no, I'm limping every day and in a brace and I need to fix that." And so it's really easy to just be like, "Eh, I'll do it later."
Troy: So it sounds like then, yeah, I mean, it sounds like it's been, the podcast editing this and listening to this has maybe been more frustrating than anything . . .
Scot: Yeah, right.
Troy: I don't know if we're doing any good for you.
Scot: I hope it's been kind of inspirational.
Mitch: Well, it has been, and especially now that I have insurance and stuff, listening to this, it's just been, it is time. It's time for me to start taking some things more seriously. I've reached out, I'm supposed to be meeting with a primary care provider. I'm supposed to be getting all of my blood panels and stuff done. I had my blood pressure taken recently. I was terrified that was going to be absolutely miserable knowing my history. But I'm good.
Scot: Well, see, it's a victory, right?
Troy: Yeah, exactly.
Mitch: Because when we were editing the podcast that was of . . . Who was it that was talking about heart pressure and they said that often the first sign is the last sign?
Scot: Right.
Troy: Yeah, right.
Mitch: You have a heart attack and die, right? So, but yeah, I'm doing all this stuff. I'm signing up to go see a mental health professional. I'm, you know, I'm just going to do it all. Just going to do it all while I . . .
Troy: You're going all in.
Mitch: All in. Whole hog. I believe one of our guests referred to it as.
Scot: Right.
Troy: So, like, are you feeling overwhelmed?
Mitch: A little bit. There is, especially as I'm scheduling some of the things, there's this really weird anxiety and fear I was not expecting. I really was not expecting it. Like, I'm sitting here and I'm like, "Oh, well, I'll just go get my blood tests done." And it's like, you know my parents and my . . . just did the 23 and me and I am predisposed to diabetes. And I have an aunt who has diabetes and she has to take injections every day and stuff like that.
I've looked at some of the symptoms and things, I'm like, "Oh no, what if I'm diabetic? What if I'm pre-diabetic?" Like, "They're going to test me and then I'll know, and then I'll have to take the shots." And I know that's weird to think about. And I know that's weird that it's like go find out, get it taken care of. But there's this, like in my brain, "I'm healthy now." Right? And as soon as that piece of information comes, I won't be.
Scot: I don't think it's weird. I've talked to a couple of my friends and I've asked them, "Why don't you go to the doctor more often?" We were having this discussion, and a couple of them actually said, "I just kind of almost don't want to know." Right? Like, "Why don't you want to get your cholesterol panel done?" And they're just like, "I really rather not know." Which I don't quite understand, but, I mean, I understand it's a real thing for some people.
Troy: Oh, it's a very, very real thing. I think sometimes I feel the same way too. I'll get various symptoms, aches, and pains, and honestly before I go one extreme or the other. Either I think it's cancer or I'm just like, "I just don't want to know." You know? And I think it's a natural reaction to be in sort of a state of denial. And it sounds like, I mean, you are feeling probably a little bit overwhelmed with all of this, but the reality is that I think the majority of people don't even think about these things till their 50s. And I think that's when you really start to see those effects.
And like you said, that's when maybe it's a wakeup call, like a heart attack or a stroke or, you know, going in and full-blown diabetes and diabetic ketoacidosis and ending up in the ER that they actually recognize these things and start to try and reverse that where, you know, you're at a point where maybe there are some nagging issues and some things that if it continued down that path could be a problem in 20 years. But the fact that you're addressing it right now I think is great. And I think probably better than what 90% of people out there are doing.
Mitch: Yeah. Awesome.
Scot: Tell us about your . . . So you went to a fitness coach.
Mitch: Oh no, yeah.
Scot: Well, no, it wasn't a fitness coach. It was like a fitness test to ascertain your level of fitness.
Mitch: Yeah. So one of the, I mean, some of the benefits we have up here is fantastic and one of them was there is a program where you are paired with a either finishing undergrad or masters kinesiology or . . . how do I pronounce that word?
Troy: Kinesiology?
Mitch: Kinesiology. So you end up being paired with a kinesiology student who's finishing up their school and they act as a personal trainer. So you go in and they do everything from testing your body fat to seeing how many push-ups, your flexibility, everything. They do a full-blown assessment. And it didn't go too well.
Troy: It did not go well?
Mitch: No. And it is really embarrassing. I was fair or needs improvement on almost all of them. But by the time we got back, we still had the bike test, right? The Vmax, finding out how your cardiovascular health is. And she gives me a look and I'm just drenched in sweat and I've been working out for maybe 20 minutes and she just says, "I think we're going to go ahead and wait till Wednesday, because I can tell you're really struggling."
And then not only that, last night, I'm supposed to be getting it done in just an hour. And she texted me saying, "Why don't we go ahead and do the easier version of this stuff?" And I did a quick Google and it's the same they use for, like, geriatric student patients and she's just stepping it way down because my cardiovascular is not where it needs to be. Not at all.
Troy: Have you been doing much cardio prior to this?
Mitch: No.
Scot: Well, then there you go, right?
Mitch: We have an answer.
Scot: Yeah, I mean . . . Well, I faced the same thing, right? Like, you know, everybody faces that same thing. If you've never hit a baseball before, you can't expect to pick up a bat and go out there and hit a baseball. Right? You got to practice. You got to put some time in.
Troy: And I guarantee, if I had done this same assessment a few years ago, I would have been in the same boat. It's just like you kind of lull yourself into this sense of security, and you look at yourself in the mirror, like, "Ah, I look okay." But then you have these things where you're actually tested on this and it really is a wake-up call.
Scot: Well, the good news is the human body adapts very quickly to exercise, good nutrition, that sort of stuff. Although it doesn't adapt as quickly as sometimes we want it to.
Mitch: Right.
Scot: Sometimes I think we expect a little too much. At one point, when I was near 30% body fat, I thought, "Well, it took me 10, 12 years to get here. Why would I expect to be able to unravel this in six weeks?" Like, right? It's going to take a little while to unravel some stuff. So, you know, you've just got to do those daily things, I think. And I think then that becomes a little less overwhelming, at least that works for me.
Troy: I agree. I think the biggest thing too, and, I mean, it sounds like, you know, obviously you are feeling a little bit overwhelmed with all this stuff. You're jumping in and getting all these things done, which is great. But yeah, that'd be my biggest concern. Sometimes I think you can get overwhelmed with just so much at once and I think you kind of have to just say, "Hey, I'm just going to do this. I'm going to start somewhere."
And I tell people, if you're not already out walking or just doing something, some sort of vigorous walking or running or biking, 30 minutes, three times a week, then just start there. Just start with walking three times a week, 30 minutes. And the benefits of that are huge. That's what's amazing. When you look at these studies, they say 30 minutes, three times a week, you're going to see incredible benefits just from that.
And I think if you start small, like I said, for me, it wasn't that long ago. We were going to run a 5K, and this was the breast cancer, you know, run for the cure, 5K for my grandmother and my aunt who both had breast cancer. I was so intimidated by this, and I am not joking. And I was thinking to myself, "I don't run." I was like, "I don't know the last time I've run and I don't know . . ." And I was very intimidated by the thought of running a 5K. And this wasn't that long ago. And so then I got to a point where I said, "I'm just going to try and go every day, just do two miles a day and just be consistent with it no matter what. Just do it." And so I think if you just start somewhere, you build from there and things progress. But the great thing for you is that's exactly what you're doing. I mean . . .
Mitch: Yeah.
Troy: You're doing what you need to do to know where you need to go and you're getting on the right track, which is really like I said, that's better than 90% of people.
Mitch: Yeah. And it's funny that you bring up that 5K, because, you know, I'm doing these mindfulness things and I'm just, "Hey, guys, I am not this person."
Scot: How's that working out for you?
Mitch: I don't know.
Scot: There was such disdain when you said that.
Mitch: I'm this little, like, punk-rocker at heart . . .
Troy: Thank you for saying that, Mitch. Thank you. I wasn't going to say it.
Mitch: Or I just, I sit down . . .
Troy: I'm all for mindfulness. But I think it's just, it's, yeah. Anyway.
Scot: I don't know. I'm a supporter of it.
Troy: I'm absolutely a supporter of it. But the answer to everything now is mindfulness and resilience. If your life sucks, you're not resilient enough.
Scot: As oppose . . .
Troy: You need to be more mindful.
Scot: I got you.
Troy: It's just like, "Okay, my mind is ready to explode from all the mindfulness."
Scot: It's like, "You've got diet problems. You need to eat more kale."
Troy: Yeah, eat more kale.
Scot: It's going to solve everything.
Troy: Why don't you eat more kale?
Scot: Yeah. It's not that simple.
Troy: It is a little overdone right now.
Scot: Yep. Got you.
Mitch: And Jonathan's been giving us collard greens, and it's like, "I'm not excited about this and I don't know . . ."
Troy: You don't get excited about collard greens?
Mitch: No. And I guess that's the other, you know, that's kind of part of it is, you know, I'm doing these mindfulness things and I think they're legitimately helping me, but at the same time, I am going to eye-roll and audibly sigh every time I do them. Like, I think that's just how I am. I'm going to drag myself through all of this, but the thing they wanted me to do is visualize one health goal, right? Visualize it, think about it, and then figure out some of these small steps you can do to get there. And it's a 5K for me.
Troy: Nice.
Mitch: You know, I'm going to have to probably go to a physical therapist and see what's up with my knee, you know, but . . .
Troy: [inaudible 00:16:36].
Mitch: . . . you know, doing those little steps, get my cardiovascular health and get my knee figured out so I can run a 5K, hopefully, in the next couple months or something.
Troy: That's great.
Mitch: Yeah, it's what I'm looking for.
Scot: Concerned about you getting overwhelmed. What's the one thing you're going to focus on? What do you think the one thing . . . What's one, like Troy was saying, what's the one thing?
Mitch: Like, one health thing or . . .
Scot: Yeah, like one health thing.
Mitch: I think it's the nagging issues. There's actually a lot of anxiety that comes from, you know, it's . . .
Scot: And that's interesting too that you say that right? Because your body is giving you mental anxiety, which is also not healthy. So if you can take care of that, that takes care of a lot of potential issues.
Mitch: Well, you know, it's things like I get a little bit of heartburn because I ate poorly, but then there's this little voice in the back of your brain that's like, "Hey, remember when you were a chain smoker back when you were doing the metal shows back in the day? Like, could it be something worse?" And so there's this fear on both sides of, you know, going to the doctor and also, like, "You don't have the best history, Mitch, and you've got to start thinking about it."
Troy: And I think it's important too, again, you kind of referenced that, but to look back, like, where was I, where am I now? Like you said you were a chain smoker. You weighed . . . probably what, 40 pounds more than you do now. I mean, look at that. That's huge. To make those changes and you got to give yourself credit. And it's so hard. I think that's what I find is sometimes you get overwhelmed like, "Well, I want to be here, but I'm here, but look how far you've come." And then it's just like, "Okay, what's the next step?" Don't make it overwhelming. "Okay, maybe I can look at my diet, try and cut back on sugars in my diet. Maybe that's the next step." Or, you know, like you said, maybe it's, "Let's get physical therapy going and . . ."
Scot: Or get off the vapor.
Mitch: I'm working on it.
Troy: Yeah, get working on it or wean down or whatever.
Scot: Just one thing at a time.
Mitch: Yeah.
Troy: Stuff like that.
Scot: And I know, like, you'd probably want to do everything all at once and we all do, right? But, sometimes, and then that's not sustainable, so.
Mitch: Yeah.
Troy: And the thing too, I don't want this to sound preachy because I'm in the exact same boat as you. Like, doing this podcast, this has really made me wake up to a lot of issues I've dealt with for a long time, and trying to say, "What can I do differently there?" And sleep is one of those. Scot and I talked a little bit about this. I have struggled with sleep since residency. And really struggled. There have been times . . . there was a time I was taking 50 milligrams of Benadryl to fall asleep at night and I would wake up four hours later and I would take another 50 milligrams of Benadryl. This was to get through a night of sleep.
And I was getting side effects from the anticholinergic side effects, right? Get jittery, dry mouth, urinary retention, all the stuff you read about in the textbook. That's what I was experiencing. I told myself, "I got to cut this," and when we talked to our sleep expert, one thing that really stuck with me, she talked about creating sleep hunger and having a regular sleep pattern and getting up. So that's something I've really tried to do, and so, like I said, I think we're all going through this as we've done this podcast of saying, "Wow, this is a wakeup call for me on some of the things I've struggled with as well, and where can I go from here and try and improve things."
Scot: I want to say this podcast, so a lot of times in the podcast world it's experts that are doing the podcast, right?
Troy: Yeah.
Scot: I don't necessarily consider this that type of podcast.
Troy: Oh, no.
Scot: Troy and I are just guys that are struggling with these same things. I've got a nagging knee issue. I'm going to go to a physical therapist in a couple of weeks.
Troy: Yeah.
Scot: I struggle with my diet and nutrition. We were just talking, I haven't exercised for a few days because I was out of town, you know? It's just this constant management of it.
Troy: Yeah, it is.
Scot: There's no perfection. There's just . . . I like the notion of yoga practice. I like the word practice because I apply that to so many things in life. It's kind of like life practice, nutrition practice. You just keep practicing, you're never going to get it perfect, you're never going to execute it awesomely, but you just keep working at it.
Troy: Yeah. You keep practicing, and the whole process of practicing is finding out what works, what doesn't work. Like you said, collard greens don't work for you. They just don't work. You've tried it, don't do it if it doesn't work.
Scot: Right. Find something else that works.
Troy: You find something else. You find what you like, you find what works, and then you can consistently reevaluate and refine. And again, I think it's huge to give yourself credit for what you've done. I mean, you've made huge progress just in the last few years. And I think anyone who's listening, you got to look back and say, "Hey, it's not perfect, but I'm making progress, I'm doing well, let's keep it going."
Scot: And keep talking to us. Anytime you need a little motivation or want to just talk about it, that's what this is about too. We're normalizing men talking about health.
Troy: Well, I love this goal. If you're okay with this, talking about your 5K goal, we can, you know, see how things are going and down the road, it doesn't have to be in two months, you know, maybe in the springtime if that's a more practical thing for you. But it'd be fun to . . . either we go out and run a 5K together, there are so many local 5Ks you can run, or we just go run a 5K distance or whatever, you know, going to be good thing to look forward to and . . .
Scot: Let's do it.
Troy: Yeah.
Mitch: Yeah, sure.
Scot: High five guys.
Mitch: High five.
Troy: High fives for all. Hey, hey, you left me hanging.
Scot: Oh. All right. This is a unusual post-show where Troy and I talk about the interview, kind of our takeaways and what we thought of the whole situation because our guest is actually still in the room.
Troy: He's with us, so we have to be really careful what we say. So that was an amazing interview, first of all. I think that might have been our best guest we've ever had.
Scot: So good.
Troy: Yeah, just, it was . . .
Scot: So good.
Troy: We really broke new ground there. It was incredible.
Scot: Podcasting ground has been broken.
Troy: Yeah.
Scot: My takeaway from that. I thought it was fun to talk to Mitch about how this podcast actually made a difference, because that is one of our goals of having these conversations is to help people perhaps realize, "Maybe I'm not as healthy as I could be or should be. And maybe I could take some steps." Much like we had our health turning point, his editing this podcast led him to that. So, even if we convert nobody else, we've been successful.
Troy: We helped Mitch.
Scot: We helped Mitch.
Troy: We've succeeded.
Scot: So that's all right. The takeaway for me was he was talking at one point about how they were really watching their diet and they were really exercising. And then he felt winded. Even though he was looking good, didn't feel physically as strong as he wanted to be. And I think it comes down to this notion of functional fitness versus looking good fitness. Looking good fitness was something I was obsessed with for many years in my life. And then I kind of started changing that. I no longer wanted to look like the guy on the cover of "Men's Health."
I just wanted to be able to function in my day to day and have that function carry on through my life. So, I thought that was interesting. And that's something I still struggle with because I still do want to look good. But I have really changed my focus of the exercise more to functional fitness, which changes the types of exercises you do then. Instead of just doing big bench presses and squats, you start actually doing maybe some more functional movements with dumbbells, kettle bells, that sort of thing.
Troy: Yeah. And like you said too, you never would guess this looking at Mitch, and it's really cool that he opened up to us and shared a lot of things about where he's been in terms of his health, where he is right now. But I think that's one thing you take away from this as well. As you mentioned there's functional health, there's the appearance. And that's one thing I realized in the ER, I see a lot of people there who, you know, even local celebrities who you just don't know what they're struggling with until you have that moment where you're really talking to them about their health and you really realize that, "Hey, we all have our struggles."
We all have our things we're working through even though we may appear healthier, everything appears like it's going well. And I think, you know, it's a larger issue as well, not just health-related but, you know, the appearance of health doesn't always translate to actual health. And, you know, it's great that he talked to us about where he's been, where he is now, his frustrations. And I hope we drove that point home as well, that we're experiencing that same thing too. To say that somehow you and I are the model of health would be far from it.
And I'm grateful that I've been able to make some changes as a result of just learning from this podcast as well and learning from these experts. And hopefully, that's what we're able to do with this. And it's not just about the specific advice, but just the conversation that keeps it on your mind and hopefully keeps you motivated to make some changes.
Scot: All right. Just going to leave this here. It's our random thoughts. Could have something to do with the show or health. Might not have anything to do with a show or and health. I'm just going to leave this here. I made an observation at the grocery store. When you go to the grocery store, Troy, and you have to buy more items than you can carry in your arms. What do you choose to do that job?
Troy: I get a basket.
Scot: Okay.
Troy: I know this is novel, like, even a shopping cart.
Scot: Yeah. Okay. So basket. Okay. There are a lot of times . . .
Troy: What do you do?
Scot: . . . there a lot of times there are two different . . .
Troy: Put your apples and oranges and, like, pull your shirt up and then just drop everything in there . . .
Scot: I wear my apron.
Troy: You wear your apron and you dump it on there.
Scot: What shopping cart do you pick? Do you pick the little small one, or do you pick the big one?
Troy: Good question. It depends. I think about it beforehand, and I will get the small one if I'm not buying a lot, the big one if I'm getting a lot of stuff.
Scot: I don't know what it is, but I've observed most men will either go for the basket or the small cart. I don't know what it is about our Y chromosome that will not allow us to pick that big cart, but then I will also notice these same men, their basket is overflowing and their little cart is overflowing and if they just get the big carts. So I don't know why we're so afraid of the big cart.
Troy: I know. It's funny.
Scot: I don't know if it makes us look less manly. If the small cart makes our shoulders look broader. I don't know if we feel like, "I shouldn't be in this grocery store, so I need to show everybody I'm just here for a couple of things. I'm not really the shopper of the family."
Troy: Yeah.
Scot: But this is just an observation. So next time you go to the grocery store, go ahead and look around and see what men are doing.
Troy: Oh, I notice this. Trust me, I'm well aware of this because for years I had never gotten a big cart. And, finally, I drew that conclusion like, "This is stupid. I'm getting the small cart every time and I'm just piling stuff on top of each other and it's just smashing the stuff that's down below. So, why don't I get a big cart?" So now I get the big cart. But I am the rare man in the grocery store with the big cart.
Scot: I want you to think about why you used to do that. You don't have to answer that now, but I just want you to think about why.
Troy: I'm thinking.
Scot: All right.
Troy: Okay. Anyway . . . Well, I'm just going to leave this here. You know, I listened to a really interesting book recently, and it's called "Factfulness" by Hans Rosling. But this author, he's a public health scientist, a physician, and he makes the point that the world is a lot better place than we think it is, which was an interesting premise for a book. He went through how he administers these surveys about, you know, literacy rates and education and health rates and immunization rates worldwide to all sorts of educated audiences, and how poorly these audiences do on these. By simple chance alone, if you administer the same survey to a monkey, they would do so much better than we do. And as he was asking these questions and saying, "Okay, what do you think the health literacy rate is in this country, or the education rate, or the vaccination rate?"
We are so pessimistic about what's going on in the world. And his point was, we've done so much in terms of global health and outreach that the world really is a much better place than we imagine. Yeah, there's a lot of work to do, but there's so much good out there that's been done, I think, through public health, through work that he's done, and so many others. So it was kind of a refreshing book to listen to and say, this is where we were 50 years ago. This was where we were 10 years ago. This is where we are now. We're doing so much better. So keep the momentum going, you know, contribute to these causes, whether it's through monetary donations or education or whatever you do, do your part. It's making a difference.
Scot: That's awesome. And it's so different from the story that you do see on social media and the story you see in the media in general. So it sounds like a refreshing read.
Troy: It was. It was very refreshing.
Scot: Time for things that people say at the end of podcasts. We are at the end of the podcast, so it's time to say those things. Troy, say some of those things.
Troy: Why would you do this to me? One day. One day, I'll figure this out. So, if you want to get in touch with us, contact any of our experts, ask questions, contact us at hello@thescoperadio.com. Check out our Facebook page, we're on Facebook at facebook.com/whocaresmenshealth. You know, if you like the podcast, please rate us, review us. We'd love to get your feedback, see what you like, what you don't like. Subscribe through iTunes, through Google Play, through any of the other various podcasting platforms. And thanks for listening and keep in touch.
Scot: Boom. Nailed it. Nice work. Thanks for listening. Oh, go ahead.
Troy: I'm trying. I'm really trying, you know, I'm trying to listen to you, learn from the masters. So hopefully, hopefully, someday I'll figure this out.
Scot: You got it.
Troy: Sure.
Scot: Thanks for listening and thanks for caring about men's health.